In fairness, it looks like Wheelers themselves never linked to the incorrect timetable, although it has to be presumed that they provided it to Traveline in the first place. Once they mentioned the W2 and the other new routes on their website, Wheelers featured links to the correct timetable on Traveline. The moral of this story is: Always check with the bus operator rather than relying solely on Traveline, especially if you last checked it more than a few days before you intend to travel. Links to the websites of all our local bus companies can be found in the right hand panel on this page.
The times in our previous post for the W3 and W5 are correct.
In other news, Bluestar 2 will be diverting in Bishopstoke for about 2 months from this Friday. Details here.
W2
ReplyDeleteThanks sotonbus for doing this.
I spoke to Wheelers in October about the error on Traveline.
It appears that up to that point Wheelers were not aware
that Traveline had an unworkable W2 timetable on display.
According to Wheelers the details must have been incorrectly
copied by Traveline from the sheet Wheelers had supplied
them with.
As a result Wheelers got in touch with Traveline and asked
for the correction to be made.
Things do seem to move slowly though with Traveline, as it
took over two weeks for the update to be made on their
web site.
What an absolute waste of time and taxpayers money service R1 is, that runs every 20 minutes Mondays to Saturdays between Woolston and the end of Weston Lane and return in Southampton, between about 0930 and 1430. On frequent observation, I have yet too see hardly anyone on any journey operated by Firstbus on contract to Southampton City Council on this service. How it has survived the time it has is unbelieveable. I notice on Firstbus website today, 25th November 2013, services cancelled due to vehicle shortage, yet they manage to operate this service with a double deck vehicle, which surely could be used for better purposes. A vehicle of only six seats, if there were one, would be even to large for the amount of customers picked up or set down on this service. Who ever at Southampton City Council or in other quarters dreamed up this service,should be seriously questioned about its cost to the taxpayer. PAC
ReplyDeleteOne of wheelers drivers told me that the only reason that they can expand, is because "the council are throwing money at them". Whether it is true or not, I dont know. The Bluestar T services to Cadnam seem to have a similar take up rate to the route described above, but at least they use tiny vehicles and only run 2 hourly in each direction.
DeleteDrivers at First are saying that Route 10 is withdrawn from early January and there are many other routes for the chop in the pipeline
ReplyDeleteWell let's hope the drivers at First are wrong about the withdrawal of service 10, as this would be yet another blow to the residents of the Upper Shirley area and the connection between Totton and Shirley. However I can see route and time changes to other services in the future, as comments by would be passengers recently on their facebook pages are far from complimentary. Most comments, some fair, but many unfair, relate to traffic congestion, and the many long term road works round Southampton, and other places within their operating area, which they or any other operator are stuck with and out of their control. We now live in a socieity that's obsessed with car ownership, and it's going to be a very brave politician of any party to challenge the private motorist to where He or She should travel without restrictions to any place,road,town,village,city or where or not to park their car. This i'm afraid is a reality. PAC
DeleteThe constant chopping and changing at First should show anyone that something is seriously wrong there. If it aint broke, you dont fix it. Everything keeps moving, chopping, changing. They appear desperate to me, and just seem to lack any cohesive planning. Their attempt with the 2 route seems to have backfired, purely because they have put so much frequency into it, and now all their buses seem to carry too few passengers for it to pay. Contrast that to Bluestars effort to encroach on to Townhill, and you see quality rather than quantity. A gentle and progressive approach to win clients, rather than the "kitchen sink" approach by First with their 2 route. I seriously doubt that First will still be in Southampton 5 years from now, but I suspect that Bluestar hope that they will be, as Arriva or Stagecoach would be far more serious competition.
DeleteInteresting comment about quality of bus services in Townhill park suggesting bluestar have the upper hand - from observation and personal use First have good new buses less than 12 months old with leather seats. I think bluestar have 9 year old buses and half the frequency ?
DeleteI think anon@27 Nov 1802 completely missed the point of my post about the 2 wars going on regarding the7/16 and 2/18 routes..... I didnt say that Bluestar had the upper hand in Townhill Park-yet. What I did say was that in Shirley, First have made a desperate attempt to win passengers with a deeply unpopular choice of throwing frequency at the route, which has made their profitability very questionable. Compare this to Bluestars approach in Townhill, which is measured and affordable. They have not tried to outrun the frequency, nor use expensive new vehicles, but are gradually gaining customers, based on service and reliability. Does the average customer have any care about new buses? I think not. What they want is a reasonable level of comfort, service, reliability and a smile. The leather seats business is an absolute non starter. Hot in summer, freezing in winter, and with the advent of air-con drying the air, they will be cracked(and of course written on) in no time. Moquette is by far the better option and has been tried and tested in preference to leather (which most bus seats used to be!) . Leather is just another desperate gimmick by First, which has yet again added to their costs and their problems.
DeleteAnon @0102 hasn't done his or her homework which somewhat undermines what could have been a thought provoking post.
DeleteFor instance air-con drying out and cracking leather - good job First's buses don't have air con then!
Customers don't care about new buses, really? Why do bus businesses invest in them for their core routes where the investment is often paid back through increased patronage!
Leather seats will be written on in no time - and moquette won't? Leather is easier to clean compared to moquette which would need replacing.
Assumption that installing leather seats is a gimmick, costly and add to their problems (whatever they may be!) - do some half decent research, there have been plenty of positive comments on social media from customers liking leather seats but I cannot recall the last time a customer posted "ooh I like the new moquette!", leather needn't be expensive to install and retrimming seats is a normal business cost undertaken every few years on most buses. Infact First seem better at maintaining decent seat coverings than other operators who's 7-8 year old vehicles now have seats almost threadbare.
The comments above seem somewhat misguided
DeleteWell its all been confirmed by the Echo today, that First 10 route is being chopped completely. Here they go again, with the merry-go-round of changes. They really are in a mess, and dont have a clue what to do next. It reminds me of a slow and painful death. How do their managers keep their jobs?
DeleteAnon @7.35. So, are you really telling me that First have installed leather seats, but fail to have air-conditioning? Its even worse than I thought! Have you ever seen moquette written on? Its almost impossible! First are very good at spending money on excessive levels of new seat coverings, whereas everyone else undertakes it when it really needs doing. Of course there is a need to replace buses from time to time, and they tend to be put on the flagship routes, but is there a shred of evidence that they increase patronage?
DeletePresumably the double decker on the R1 is due to it slotting between peak school work which requires double deck capacity. It is usually cheaper to use a spare but oversized school bus on work that is off-peak only, rather than to purchase and maintain a seperate minibus that would then sit idle at peak times.
ReplyDeleteYes I agree with you as to why the R1 is double deck operated, and why it would make no sense in having a small bus for this service, that would be sat in the depot outside of off peak hours not earning any revenue. However the ordinary general public see what they see, and have little or no idea of the exact situation as to why this should be. I just try to base my comments on how the ordinary member of the public view what they see,and not in what I presume is the reason for the double decker in this instance. I'm covinced though the vehicle could be used as a shoppers service somewhere else in Southampton, where it would carry far more passengers between 0930 and 1430, than the route it's on at present. As an example the cut off area at Lordshill North would have benefitted from a local service between these hours to Shirley via Lordshill Centre,then Rownhams Road to Maybush Corner then Romsey Road to Shirley(Park Street) then a loop via Oakley Road,Tesco and Tebourba Way back to Maybush Corner then Rownhams Road and Lordshill Centre back to Lordshill North(loop) If this service ran at 40 minute intervals between 0930 and 1430 people living in Lordshill North would be able to change bus at Lordshill Centre or Shirley for other main route destinations. It would also give them chance to shop at Tesco if they wished. Although not great numbers of passengers would be carried, it would I'm sure carry more than the R1 service does at present, and better use of ratepayers money. PAC
DeleteWhen Lordshill North did have a regular bus service it was very poorly used as most residents walk through to Lordshill Centre where there are far more buses to choose from running more frequently. The real killer for Lordshill North though is its in Hampshire and not Southampton City so the City Council (quite rightly IMHO) take the view of why should they pay for a bus service for residents who do t pay council tax to them.
DeleteAt Lordshill North Buchanan Road,Matheson Road,Sinclair Road and Sutherland Road as with the short section of Rownhams Road North,are in Southampton and not in Test Valley. In the case of Rownhams Road North it's admitedly only just within Southampton. PAC
DeleteI quite agree with you that the taxpayers outside of Southampton should not be expected to pay for a bus service that's in Southampton. I did add a comment in reply to you about four days ago,but so far it has not appeared on this site, too the fact that Rownhams Road North,Buchanan Road,Matheson Road,Sinclair Road and Sutherland Road are within the Southampton city boundary, and not in Test Valley Council area. However I must admit that Rownhams Road North is only just within Southampton when viewing the boundary, on what I must presume are correct Ordnance survey maps. PAC
DeleteNo its true First route 10 is being withdrawn last day 3rd January. Its just the start though as changes are being made to other routes too.
ReplyDeleteBoth Bluestar and First trolls appear to be active on here!!
ReplyDeleteAs a regular user of both Shirley to town and town to Portswood services, I observe that the Bluestar 16 is having little impact on the 7s. That said, I doubt First are making much money on the 7s, but are certainly carrying more passengers per bus than Bluestar are on the 16.
As to the 2 vs 18 Millbrook traffic, I think it is about even loadings per bus at the times I travel. The 18 would do better but for its tendency to bunch and run 2 buses together every 15 minutes rather than one every 7/8. In fairness, First found it hard to avoid bunching on cross-city routes as well (and still do on the 3) but the 2 is noticeably better spread than the 18, particularly away from City.
To be honest, neither side is winning!!
For what its worth given the regular appalling holdups in Shirley High Street, I actually think First had the right idea with the X2, but weren't patient enough or didn't market it well enough.
There, an outbreak of even-handedness
Thanks for the even handed comments. I think we all have different perspectives, but to label everyone who finds a particular operator as a troll is wrong in my opinion. Bluestar 16 must be having some impact on the 7 route, or they are completely new customers who ride on it? Big rumour today is that Bluestar are to make further route adjustments to the 16 in January, which is further proof that they are not yet having the impact that they want, but that they are determined to break through on that route.
DeleteI totally agree with your comments regarding the X2 and the 2 vs 18 situation. Bluestar are not regulating their cross town 18 nearly well enough and are handing an advantage to First. The problem that First have however is that their 2 service is so frequent, that it cant survive economically. Your comment that neither side is winning, is spot on, however which side is losing most? It will be First in my opinion, purely because they have put too much frequency on the route for it to be profitable, and with the lack of trust that the public seem to place in First (due to their constant changes), I think it likely that Bluestar will have lost far less than they may have expected.
Well here we go again! Yet more significant service changes by Firstbus in Southampton as from 5th January 2014. I'm beginning to wonder if anyone who keeps changing these services realy knows what they are doing. Yet again with the withdrawel of service 10,the Upper Shirley/Hill Lane area is hit, as is Totton by losing it's connection to Shirley. We do not know yet wether Southammpton City Council has any alternitive arrangements for the Upper Shirley area, or if any other operator will decide to keep a connection between Totton and Shirley. Again we see people living in Peartree,Merryoak and Harefield messed around again. It's no wonder confidence in Firstbus operations are being lost by the public in these areas,and they find alternative ways of travel. I note from the Firstbus website that a bus saved on Service 10 will be used to increase the frequency of service 1, yet meanwhile it appears we retain service R1 in the same area as service 1, pottering around most of the day with no customers. Tell me the sense of this nonsense? PAC
ReplyDeleteI have just sent you a comment regarding service changes by Firstbus in Southmapton as from 5th January 2014. The reference to service 1 should read service 11 and I'm sorry in this error. PAC
ReplyDeleteSo First have gone ahead and started eroding the Southampton network again. Bluestar are rumoured to be looking to register a service to Weston and you will note that First will be increasing frequency from City to Weston to every 7 and a half minutes! What a shower!
ReplyDeleteI think it very unlikely that Bluestar have any interest in Weston. That rumour has been going on forever, but nothing ever seems to come of it.
DeleteOf course times change but BS gave up Weston (Hamble to Millbrook) and took over the 47 (now bs1) many years ago. The 29 route was the last route BS had over the Itchen Bridge which also was long abandoned except for the rerouted BS3
DeleteThis blog also has lots of comments either for First or Bluestar - currently mainly anti first - lets not forget the Shirley/Totton section was originally H&D and is currently poorly used on this section.
Of course both operators increase their frequencies when they see competition - remember the Beep Bus and BS8
I would imagine (but am only speculating) that perhaps the 10 has become uneconomical due to the fact that both Taunton's and Totton College now have their own dedicated bus service provided by Xelabus. This would surely have removed a lot of patronage from the 10, reducing the income recieved.
ReplyDeleteI must say I agree with all of the comments made by Ben! At last an even-handed comment hidden amongst a lot of the normal bias.
As I write the revised times as from 5th January 2014 are now on the Firstbus website for service 1 upto 8/8a/8b. There are noticeable errors on some of the timetables. In communicating with Firstbus they state that they have had technical problems, and where there are errors or omissions, they hope to put them right after midnight 4th December 2013. A point they have cleared with Me, which in their website statement seems to have confused many people, is that the re-routed service 13 will NOT serve Thornhill after the 4th January 2014. I could be wrong but feel it's new route will not be too popular with some of the public, but could give a service back to Harefield on Sundays which they lost 6 months ago. Until we see the timetable published for this service officially by Firstbus we don't know.
ReplyDelete