Particularly under threat are Wheelers W1 and Xelabus X12, which could potentially cut off people in Highfield and Regent's Park.
Age UK criticised the proposals, which is all well and good, but until they start campaigning for bus companies to be correctly reimbursed for accepting pensioners' passes, routes that primarily serve pensioners, like the W1 and X12, will become uneconomical for councils to continue to support.
It would seem looking at yesterdays Meridian news Portsmouth City Council will be going down the same road.Also in my observation at off peak most services only carry pensioners and also large numbers of persons with disabled passes.There are of course exceptions to this on a few routes,but in the main most people that use to use a bus now have their own transport,and are jolly glad they have,and are prepared to sit in traffic jams all day,should that be the option,rather than use a bus
ReplyDeleteThe Wheelers W1 timetable which commences on 29th December is now on line, and reflects route changes and a reduced level of service from that date. To be honest, I'm amazed the service has lasted as long as it has without any subsidy, as concessionary pass reimbursement alone will never be enough to support any service - you need full fare paing punters.
ReplyDeleteWhat waas the Wheeler's slogan "The future's bright,The futures Orange".Perhaps it should now read "The future's dim,The future's Black.
DeleteYou are now seeing what us old gits in the industry have been saying for years . . . . OAP reimbursement simply isn't enough.
ReplyDeleteThe rule from DaFT is that bus companies should "be no worse or no better" off for carrying an OAP than a fare-paying passenger. In practice, reimbursement is around 50% of the average bus fare, so if a bus company says the fare is £2, they receive around £1 per OAP carried.
IF (and it's a big if) there are enough full fare paying passengers around, then a living is still to be made (and by-the-by . . . enough means around 60% of total passengers). So, if the bus carries a full load of real passengers in the peaks, and large numbers of OAP's off peak . . . . it all balances out.
Now then . . . . most "supported" town services are nowadays designed for those areas of towns where commercial bus services just won't pay, so by definition that's the off-peak routes to get people to / from shops; hospitals etc. Guess what . . . most of the passengers don't pay (off-peak), so the income is based on OAP reimbursement, which is only 50% of the true value of the journey. The result is that thses routes lose even more money!
And the delicious irony? The councils set the OAP reimbursement rate!! So the reason that these routes lose money is that the tendering authority pays too little to themselves for OAP reimbursement! Let's not forget that DaFT didn't ring-fence the OAP reimbursement grant anyway, so said grant generally gets lumped into the overall transport pot.
Och well . . . . . I don't suppose it'll really matter.
Greenline's comment is exactly why Pennine and other long-established operators have given up. West Yorkshire PTE and Lancashire County Council both paid FAR more than did North Yorkshire. As I've said before in these columns, surely, it can't be right that a passenger going from (say) Unitary Authority Area A to County Council Area B can be worth more in one direction than in the other, because one authority pays more than its neighbour.
ReplyDeleteIt does not help, either, that the continued tightening of the rules on using the OAP pass means the first bus on which I can use mine passes my local stop at 09.45. Previously, the first available was at 09.00. This 09.45 gets me into Southampton to give me a 55 minute wait for a bus to Salisbury. Once I eventually in Salisbury, it's more or less time to think about getting a bus back, so I can avoid the tea-time rush. No wonder more and more are getting or continuing to use their cars, or using the train - which, if they have the Over 60s Railcard - is often cheaper than going on earlier buses and paying.
If you were that bothered about having to take the later bus you could always pay to get the earlier one?
DeleteNice to see you being so grateful for your free pass, and I suspect it is joyriders like you that have ruined the scheme for everyone.
Rant over
I do wish people would get the perspective of Pennine going out of business correct.
DeleteThe owners of the company were quite happy to accept a loss made running buses to offset the rental income from the properties they owned for many years.
The partners only acted once the losses were actually going to cost them something.
The ony part of the network deemed commercially viable was picked off by Transdev in 2009 and only after that did Pennine consider buying low floor buses. They studiously avoided any form of tendered work and pitched their fares at a high price to ensure what was operated was viable.
The issues of poor concessionary reimbursement are a contributing factor but are a flag of convenience.
Whilst their demise is indeed sad (the level of customer service, customer loyalty and vehicle presentation was amongst the best I've seen anywhere) it is indicative of a failure to embrace change and move with the times.
The main driving force of the business had passed away and no doubt the remaining partners interest in continuing was something they felt less obliged to observe,
Did Wheelers get a SCC subsidy for the Highfield Lane and Westwood Road sections ? Travelling into Southampton about 10 today the bus had about 20 passengers on departing Baddesley, picked up 2 at Chilworth and a further 2 who travelled the length of Westwood Road. 3 got off in Portswood and the rest in the City Centre.
ReplyDeleteIt is certainly true that the majority of day time passengers have free passes but how many, apart from School Children, use peak hour buses?
I don't know of any subsidy for the Westwood Road & Highfield Lane sections, Anon48, but I suspect there may well be (or may have been). I've only used it a couple of times, as an alternative to the Blue Star 4. On both occasions people have commented to the drivers, when boarding in the outlying areas of Romsey, how nice it is to have the ability to go direct to Southampton without having to use two different buses for the journey (different companies). Long may the W1 continue!
DeleteHighfield is subsidised by SCC
DeleteIt is a very difficult situation.
ReplyDeleteThe world expects private companies to provide a full service on a minimal pittance. I disagree somewhat that companies receive "around half" an adult fare for OAP and disabled pass holders, as from the information I get, it is around 25% (47p average on a £2 minimum fare around here) is the norm; according to the local accounts staff (who should know.....).
For a majority of pass holders they are likely able to drive, are able-bodied and demand a priority over everyone else. For the majority of disabled pass holders they are humbled at being given complementary travel. This is from my daily (and yes that is 6 to 7 days a week - using my full fare monthly paid pass) commuting experience.
The core reasoning behind the OAP and Disabled bus passes, as far as I can understand, was to provide an essential service to improve quality of life, rather than provide a free jolly jaunt to far away places, which is how a minority seem to see it.
I suggest making OAP passes half fare again rather than free, and re-aligning disabled passes available to those who actually need it, such as physical and mental disabilities that make it illegal to drive and unreasonable to expect an alternative, rather than everyone entitled to Personal Independence Payments.
Rant Over.
Most OAP's would be only too happy to contribute to paying some kind of fare.However the law as it stands prohibits it.Only Central Government can change this which at present they seem reluctant to do.
DeleteOAPs could contribute though, it is as simple as leaving their pass in their purse and asking for a return to X once in a while.
DeleteEven if they did it one in 5 trips. For many that would still only be once a week.
and I doubt anyone who says "I asked for a ticket and the bus driver refused saying he thought I was a Concessionary Pass holder."
Not hard to contribute if OAPs really wished to. They just buy a normal bus ticket like everyone else and keep their pass in their purse. Obviously the bus companies can't say this out loud.
DeleteWith only five weeks till Christmas,you would have thought first would have made their Christmas services known!
ReplyDeleteThe times for First are now being shown on their website
ReplyDeleteRather bizarre of First to only run the three,on New Years day.
ReplyDeleteYes very odd move-a big operator operating just one route all day,mind this is First we`re talking about.
DeleteAre they heavily involved in a rail replacement contract?
DeleteGuaranteed money vs Speculative profit and all that
Are they heavily involved in a rail replacement contract?
DeleteGuaranteed money vs Speculative profit and all that
Not at all bizarre. NYD is very quiet by comparison with Boxing day; I once drove a whole shift for an operator (nether First or GoAhead) and took no cash at all.
DeleteClearly First are running Southampton to be profitable and GSC are running Bluestar for market share.
Time will tell which is the better strategy..............
Someone on Bluestar`s Fb page reckons they have heard that BS16 is being cut.Is it just gossip ,or does anything know anything concrete on this?
ReplyDeleteShould be anybody by the way.
DeletePassenger numbers on Bluestar 16 are very disapointing!So many complaining at the loss of First`s no.12,Bluestar step in and find there`s no real demand after all!Bluestar can`t afford to run countless buses between Bitterne and city,carrying only two passengers!Use it or lose it!
DeleteWhich is why First withdrew the 12 between Townhill and City centre. Looks like they got this decision right at least.......
DeleteIn answer, first, to Anon at 20 November 22.47 : "Most OAPs would be happy" Would they really? Most of my travelling companions who have the pass describe it as being the difference between paying the bus fare to go earlier or having a cup of coffee once there. They would prefer the coffee.
ReplyDeleteIn answer to Anon at 21 November 02.06 - who are you to say that I do or do not pay for journeys before the pass times kick in? I do use the bus before 09.30, actually. It depends on where I am going. I use the train sometimes as well. When I wait for the first available bus after 09.30, it gets me into Hedge End, Woolston or City Centre later than I would have arrived home after paying to use an earlier bus or getting the car out, or going by train.
Unfortunately, that cup of coffee every Concessionary Pass holder would prefer could mean the difference between your service running or being cut.
DeleteWould you not prefer to support a bus service to keep it running?
Well said anon 23 November 2015 at 1930
DeleteLooking at the Wheeler's W1 service new timetable from 29th December 2015 it is noted that there is a route change in the Halterworth area
ReplyDeleteInteresting to note also,that whilst Xelabus changes from January 2016 have been displayed on their website, plus the HCC website for some considerable time,that no mention has yet been made of the Wheeler's W1 changes from 29th December 2015 on either their site or the HCC site.
DeleteI see First have announced changes to their 13 route,but it would just appear to be two extra journeys.
ReplyDeleteWhich is frankly all that is required - even the first bus after 9am isn't full.
DeleteFirst clearly got this wrong, and I don't really know why - it was obvious that there was a sizeable school flow to and from Woodlands.
Looking at the statement First have issued regarding the slight change to the 13,it states this is being done after talks with local residents and Woodlans School.Would it not have been better before introducing the timetable for the 13 as recently as September 2015,if they had not spoken to Woodlans School to get it more or less right in suitable times for the pupils attending the school.I do find with First that when they change a service or the times for it,and then a number of months after have to change it again,issue some pretty silly statements as to why it's being changed again.As to the fact that they intend to put D/D vehicles on the service in case of loading problems,most of the day the service only carries older people,who are very reluctant for short journeys to use the upper deck,and as has been stated the loadings for most of the day are poor anyway.In fact where over the years First have tinkered round with Harefield so many times,and in other areas as well,most have found other ways to travel and deserted the bus.
DeleteNew Xelabus timetable for january 2016 now available
ReplyDelete