Tuesday, 4 August 2015

Timetables out / Map nostalgia

First have released the new timetables for those routes changing on 6th September. See them here.

Bluestar have published the timetables for their routes that are changing on 1st September, which can be seen here.

With the axing of route 5 and the eastern half of the 12, the First network will look significantly smaller than it does today. This is part of a long term trend though, as a look at this First Southampton network map from September 2009 shows:


The new one hasn't yet been released, but here's the one that's valid up to 5th September:


The next one will have nothing running to Swaythling & Bassett Green and more empty space east of the Itchen.

43 comments:

  1. At the rate of change they won't need to produce a map in the future or a timetable booklet.Shame to see the operation shrinking at such a pace.

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  2. I am not sure how you can report more empty space to the east of the Itchen, when there is only one very small piece of network not covered between Townhill Way and Witts Hill, and even that might be covered by the Bitternme Hopper when comparing the new network to the current network

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  3. Just seen the new no.9 timetable,with hourly gaps at times on Mon-Fri and just an hourly service from mid Saturday afternoon.Absolutely crazy!

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    1. Wonderful incentive to get the car out, and cause more congestion. This, in turn, will cause more cuts because the buses can't get through the traffic.

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    2. I would imagine local Taxi operators such as Bitterne Cab Company will be over the moon with the cuts in the area.

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  4. You may as well pack up and leave now ,First!Goodbye and good riddance,to a useless outfit!

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  5. I think that is a very uneducated comment. And if they did go watch the fares shoot up like a rocket and the frequencies drop on core corridors. Or if you regulate then watch the frequencies drop to 30 mins on all corridors and watch the council tax rise.

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    1. Really??I`m sure any other operator could do a better job and leave Southamptons city network far more stable.It is an incompetent bus operator,who after running the city network for more than 15 years,has to keep havivg major changes every 5 mins.

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    2. So why aren't you running a bus network in the city ?

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    3. It's a nonsense to suggest that if services were regulated then the frequencies all over the City would become every 30 minutes, and when council tax rises it's normaly due to other reasons.I've never yet seen an announcement by the council that because of bus issues in the City we are having to raise council tax.At present on certain corridors within the City the service is far overbused for the usage.Shirley as an example is way overbused,however at this change I note that First are making a start in addressing the situation.

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    4. Anon@10.51,IF i had the cash i would!!

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    5. In the meantime First could do with someone like me,who know Southampton well and knows what southampton bus users are looking for,rather than someone sitting in an office ,possibly as far away as Aberdeen,to steer them in the right direction.

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    6. So you can't put your money where your mouth is then to anon 23:45.
      to Anon 23:57 if you are that good why are you not working for First. How do you know what Southampton bus users want ? (that is quite a bold statement to make without evidence). I think your lack of knowledge, thinking someone in Aberdeen designs the routes is somewhat off the beaten track - it is irrelevant where people sit, its whether they know the area etc. again keyboard operators who have seem to be immune to the commercial reality of running a business

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    7. Well it's clear First don't know what Southampton residents want, as they would not keep making so many changes in comparison to other operators in the area.It would also be fair to state that First in some instances localy seem to make some strange commercial decisions,but in some instances they do have their good points.Perhaps as you keep making comments about so called keyboard operators, you might wish to comment on what you think overall of the First September 2015 changes

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    8. I think it is quite simple really: the services that First have changed clearly don't make a suitable return. Therefore you adjust your supply accordingly. This is the powers of the free market working. The vast majority of commentators on here struggle to get their head around this, and most just don't like the fact that this is the free market. This is what is meant to happen since 1986. What is happening in Southampton is what is happening in may towns and cities across the land, whereby operators are focussing on key corridors only, and this is where the investment is going. Over the past years the local authorities have stepped in with tender money to maintain certain aspects of a network - this has changed over recent years with funds drying up at local councils. Therefore, I don't have a problem with the changes, it is just market forces working. As has been mentioned on here before by someone, if the changes that First are making are that foolish, why have we not seen anyone filling all gaps - the answer is that the gaps are probably appropriate to the level of demand, and in fact there is very little of the network which has been lost in its entirety. Again unlike a number of commentators on this forum I work in Southampton and use the bus - therefore I may well be in the in the minority of this forum as I seem to believe many people don't live or work in the city who commentate. Hope that answers your question

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    9. Thank you for your reply.As you work in Southampton I'm pleased to note you use the bus and the changes don't affect you.They don't particularly affect me either, as a Southampton resident and daily bus user, as I fotunetly live in an area with an excelent bus service.Perhaps others that work in Southampton or in a local district of Southampton, would like to inform us as to how the changes might affect them

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    10. Anon @ 1909 on 6/8 said " if the changes that First are making are that foolish, why have we not seen anyone filling all gaps"

      Hows that humble pie tasting? Looks like Bluestar are starting to fill the gaps with sensible network planning and good luck to them!

      See, this is how you do it First!

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    11. Yes,looks as if anon@1909 posted a bit to soon His remark

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    12. Haha so true.Well done Bluestar!

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  6. I can quite see why First in some instaces come in for criticism as to how they operate. If you look back to the timetable book of 2012 and the Townhill Park to Lordshill route when it was service 2, and it's history upto today where it's service 12 it's had continual change over this short period in how it's been operated. As an example a small one it had an hourly evening service until late connecting Townhill Park and Bitterne. Later on the very late journeys were withdrawn as to being not commercialy viable,not enough customers said First.Then at a later stage again these late journeys were reinstated,but this time at a 30 minute frequency.As most late evening journeys at present operated on any service are not particularly well patronised,it's rather difficult for the public to understand why you would reintroduce something you have told the public in the past is not commercialy viable at double the frequency.Under the new timetable from September of course there will be no 12 between Townhill Park and City,however for those in Midanbury who are shopping in Bitterne, on Mondays to Fridays two extra journeys have been added to the B2 to help a bit by courtesy of Southampton City Council via of its ratepayers

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  7. We need a social enterprise operator to take over!They have a social enterprise operator providing buses on Jersey,where all the profits are reinvested in the community,rather than some greedy shareholder.

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  8. Do we really need the empty no.2 buses running every 20 mins ,in the evenings,from September?The numpty who came up with that needs sacking!

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  9. Quite agree. You will also note if you look on service 3 where they reduced the evening frequency from every 20 minutes to every 30 minutes they are now putting it back to every 20 minutes.Another example from First where they state it's not commercialy viable,but when it suits them it becomes so again.Wonder how soon the next change will be after this one in September 2015.

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  10. I note that the route between City and Woolston via Chapel which up to now has one bus per hour,from September 2015 gets three buses per hour as the revised 9 and 13 route will now serve Chapel.It's interesting to note that for most of the day between Woolston and City the 9 departs at 08 minutes past the hour and the 13 departs at 09 minutes past the hour with an additional 9 at 38 minutes past the hour.On return from City to Woolston the 9 is at 00 and 30 minutes past the hour and the 13 at 25 minutes past the hour.Why the 13 has to serve Chapel is a mystery,but I suspect this has been done due to the fact where it will be hourly you can operate the route with one bus and by changing the route between Bitterne and Harefield and between Woolston and City to how it operates at present,you save quite a lot of minutes in running time.Here again I would not think the majority of present customers would not be too happy that it will no longer serve Holy Rood/West Quay

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    1. It was part of the planning consent for the housing development in the Chapel area that the developer would fund a bus service through there, although I am a long way from being clear as to why it should suddenly qualify for such a dramatic increase in buses per hour. I'd agree with Anon at 08.55 that having the 13 go this way appears to be superfluous. It could just as easily go via Ocean Village.

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    2. Oh well another area that I suspect will loose the service when the developers money runs out

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  11. Interesting feature comparing the network maps. By comparison here are the network maps for 2008 and 31 Aug 2015 for Yellow Buses in Bournemouth. They share many similarities with First Southampton: A former council-owned town operator which has also been in private hands for both periods shown, that faces strong competition from Go South Coast ("More" instead of "Bluestar"), particularly on key corridors such as Poole>Southbourne where both operate very high frequency services (think Millbrook>Southampton).

    2008>
    https://web.archive.org/web/20081031114630/http://www.yellowbuses.co.uk/pdfs/schematics08/0408%20YB%20Schematic%20Map_hybrib_tybw.pdf

    2015>https://www.bybus.co.uk/app/uploads/2015/08/Full-Schematic-0815.pdf

    Where First has contracted, Yellow Buses have expanded - taking advantage of rivals cutbacks and spotting/trying out opportunities. Where First constantly reroute and change frequency, the owners of Yellows (Transdev then RATP) have provided stability with timetable changes a rarity and maintaining evening services/frequency.

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    1. But the 2008 map is from after they rehashed the network and cut out all the crap!

      Unfortunately, Yellow Buses are making some cuts now also.

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  12. Good Morning

    For information, Xelabus Limited has at 0001 this morning taken over the Brijan Tours buses, staff and routes 7, 8, 15 and 17 one month earlier than the original plan. This is as a result of a request by the Director of Brijan Tours. The buses will now operate from Xelabus depot at Barton Park. From 7th September 2015 the planned change will come into effect with all Brijans vehicles withdrawn and replaced by Xelabus buses.

    Customer Service
    Xelabus Limited

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    1. Hi are you getting new buses for the routes next month?

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    2. I think if you look at the Xelabus Enthusiast site that Xelabus have very kindly already informed those that are interested in vehicles of as to what will be operated on the former Brijan routes.

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    3. But they haven't said what's being used on the upcoming X15 and X17

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    4. Why should any bus operator have to inform anyone as to what vehicles they will be useing on any particular route

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  13. And just through on VOSA...

    PH1121126/298 - GO SOUTH COAST LTD T/A BLUESTAR, 2-8 PARKSTONE ROAD, POOLE, BH15 2PR
    Registration Accepted by SN
    Starting Point: Southampton Central Station
    Finish Point: Sholine (Montgue Avenue)
    Via:
    Service Number: BLUESTAR 7
    Service Type: Normal Stopping
    Effective Date: 06-SEP-2015
    Other Details: Daily Monday to Saturday every 30 mins Sunday hourly

    I'm no traditional First-basher, but it does seem like they've made a huge balls up on this occasion.

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    1. Bit strange it's starting at Southampton Central though

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  14. Looks as if it's the start of pay back time on First

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    1. Great!Well done Bluestar!!

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    2. It will be going via City College, meaning the area will have FIVE Buses per hour, the best service City College has ever had!

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    3. Yes,strange how this district has suddenly become very popular with operators considering whoever lives in the area only has a very short walk into the City Centre, which of course is what the majority do. Never noticed much traffic in the Woolston direction myself either

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    4. I see on the GSC Enthusiast website Bluestar 16 will be diverted via northam bridge and bitterne it will be staying at every 15min

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  15. The timetable for the new 7 is now being shown on the Bluestar website-Will be interesting to see what the fares will be on the new service plus the cost of the day ticket-Will also please the commentator on this site who stated " If First are making foolish changes why has no one else stepped in"

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  16. Great news!That`s why Bluestar are far superior to First!Hope everyone boycotts First`s new no.10 and sticks to the no.18 ,to show them our contempt,for how they have treated Southampton`s bus users over the years.Hope everyone supports Bluestar 7,so that it`s here to stay and may want them to fill the other gaps left by the attrocious First.

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    1. Your spelling is atrocious. Don't they give you a spelling test before employing you in the GSC marketing department? Clearly not. Was it you who had the Beach Buses marked up with 112 and then changed the service number to 99?

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